I played State League for South Hobart in the late 90's and loved it! Especially the time we beat the then mighty Devonport 3-2 at Devonport. What made it better was all the Dev players, except Snow, sooked off after the game rather than join us in the bar. I think I outjumped Snow from a corner and South player Chris Reyner flicked the ball past the keeper (I think it was Bob Smith) for the winner.
But enough about me... What are your thoughts on a State League? Could it work? Who should the teams be?
Three teams from the north max. two from Launceston, One from the coast. At the moment it would have to be Devenport and Rangers for the simple reason that Devenport have proven themselves for years and Rangers have demonstrated that they have the foresight and knowhow to build themselves into a successful club. Plus I would have thought that their reserve teams, the teams that would then become their NPL senior teams, would more than hold their own against many senior teams around at the moment. City for the third as they have the financial recources to build themselves into the club they once were. With the possible exception of Prospect,(although they would probably have to win the next two NPL premierships plus demonstrate they can bring youth to their club) I really don't think that any other club can seriously be considered at the moment.
ReplyDeleteI personally believe we are at least 5 years away from at state league, we need to take into account the teams that are left and what will happen to them. Clubs would lose their best players to other teams and the NPL would become a glorified social league. Keep things as they are I say
ReplyDeleteYou was have an insight to the Knights I am not aware of? Ps Rangers ground with a cricket pitch will not be up to standard that is fact!
ReplyDeleteThen the fact that Rangers will have a cricket pitch free ground in time for 2013 "proposed" State league will bode quiet nicely for the club then.
ReplyDeleteI will say that Im pro state league but it will require an almost fool proof design before I throw my 100% support behind it. Have not been involved in a club at state league level before, and can hear the cries of those that have, but I think it is something we should build toward, solong as it is not at the deterament of the northern clubs as a whole.
ReplyDeletePersonaly, I believe the balance can be found in a more involved State Wide Cup or State wide Champions league.
But I have an open mind, and look forward to seeing what FFT Present.
But back in 2006 and 2007 it would have been somerset and city for sure as they finished 1 - 2 in those years, so by 2013 it may be olympic and ulverstone, who knows? I still argue that they should be regional based say 2 lonnie and 1 NW.
ReplyDeleteI doubt many Burnie,/ Somerset players will travel to Devonport to play, likewise if somerset get in I doubt many Port players will do the travel either.
Also many existing administrators would be more likely to join a regional bid than another club, that way they may be able to work for both.
It would free up sponsors for both state and club teams as well.
Selection of a club team is fraught with trepidation, as parochialism runs hot on the north west.
Please do tell us about this "new" ground Captain Oz ??
ReplyDeleteHow funny is it that we are knocking the idea of a state league but we talk up an "A" League side.
ReplyDeleteI have a question for FFT, where is the money from FFA ??
AFL Tas receive money to run the comp from AFL so when is FFA passing on some funds ? or do they and we never see it !
Doubt FFT would have any dramas with NTCA straight from CEOs mouth.
ReplyDeleteIf a state league is to go ahead and I hope and doubt it will these will be the teams I reckon:
1.South Hobart
2.Zebras
3.Clarence
4.Glenorchy
5.Newtown or Olympia
6.Devonport
7.Rangers
8.Launceston City
anom 16:05
ReplyDeleteSo you are saying that NTCA ground is fit for soccer, ground and rooms but not fit to receive cricket matches without massive upgrade ! hmmmm must be a ranger lol
I think you'll find Launceston City finished 4th in 2007 and Devonport finished 2nd. I think you'll find that Devonport have finished either first or second every year, except 2006, since the collapse of the State League. Couple that with 'probably' the best facilities on the NW Coast and Dev would be the ideal place to host a NW Team. I do agree with Nigel, it should be a regionally based team and called the 'North-West somethings'.
ReplyDeleteWhy Rangers and City over other Launceston sides ?
ReplyDeleteKnights have best complex in launceston and a far safer surface than NTCA
Anonymous 15.37
ReplyDeleteYou may not be aware that every player registered in Tasmania pays an amount to FFA as part of his/her registration...
...And you are aqsking for FFA'financial help!!
the CEO's mouth wont have a say when the clubs complain and players strike seroius injury with what is clearly a major concern for player saftey to play on what at the start of the season may as well be concrete !!
ReplyDeleteAnd if Rangers dont think they have an issue they are playing with themselves as normal
Devonport should be required to increase the size of their visitor rooms before they are admitted to a state league. As for Launceston City, their changerooms should be demolished and started again...
ReplyDeleteLauny City??? I doubt they would even be considered. Burnie/Somerset combined team. Devonprt/Ulv, Rangers, prospect and 6 from Hobart to make 10 team comp...or 4 from hobart to make 8 team comp. Big question is will NW clubs be able to put aside the us/them and combine to make powerful clubs? It has to happen and will be great for all the young talent up there.
ReplyDeleteIf it is to happen why not take a leaf out of A.f.l State league.Ok i know my thought wont count but here it is.
ReplyDeleteIt should be a 5 from the south 3 from the north and 2 from the north/west.Ok say devonport and somerset went into it then there should be a line drawn say at penguin.Then what should happen is Somerset get all players from smithton to penguin including burnie,Also devonoprt should get all players from penguin to latrobe.When players are selected to play state league they play for the club in their zone.If dropped or cant make the side then you go back to your affiliated club.I know money is the other biggest problem but maybe thats one idea to get the numbers for state league on the n/w coast???
Sam Cocks
Firstly to the knockers of the NTCA, I would be interested to hear of the last "pitch related" injury as a result of the NTCA surface or cricket pitch. Perhaps a graze or two in the early months, but that’s about it. Now before you lot launch into me for being an ignorant so and so, I am the first to criticize the fact that we have a cricket pitch in the middle of our ground, and I will work as hard as I can to rectify this, no one at the club is happy with a cricket pitch in the middle, and it has long been a topic in the bar after a game after a few beers as to what our options are, for 10 years I have failed to find a viable one, and cant see anything changing in the short term unless I win Tatslotto and donate a major part of that to a new ground. If your being honest though, a cricket pitch is about all that’s wrong with the facility outside of being dated. At the end of the day, we are all amateur clubs and where else to you suggest we play?
ReplyDelete"So you are saying that NTCA ground is fit for soccer, ground and rooms but not fit to receive cricket matches without massive upgrade ! hmmmm must be a ranger lol" Who ever you are consider the facts that you are talking about! first class cricket matches are not being scheduled compared to amateur football, Moreover there is 4 games of cricket played at the NTCA every weekend of the summer with not a penny spent, and that could continue for another 10 years if necessary. Not a valid argument!
I have fast learnt these forums rarely contribute anything other than slander behind anonymity. But I will continue for those that are genuinely interested, because whether you like Rangers or not, without us, or any other current club and then some for this matter, a state league will leave the remaining NPL sides playing each other every second week, so think about what is the best for the game, not what is wrong with it!
Now re the NTCA development as I was asked to comment on, - The NTCA will begin the redevelopment "stage 1" as early as late this year, but realistically January/Feb 2012, this will include:
• the full removal of the No 2 ground perimeter fence, drainage and earth works to run two full size football pitches running east west either side of the existing wicket block.
• 6 light towers including the lights.
• Redevelopment of all change rooms and provision of two new ones for shared multi gender participation in one facility.
Stage two and three will rely on the federal government communities grant program, but LCC have a very promising portfolio to present to Canberra and should be successful, If this goes ahead, the NTCA will be a fantastic facility, reserved for grass roots sport, thats not to say there will be no pursuit of first class cricket, but it’s unlikely, and a new drop in pitch at York Park will probably take care of this.. This means the benefits will remain with the users and their competitors, rather than being tied up for the most of the year like york park, which is a fine facility, but spends some 300 days a year not doing anything other than letting the precious grass grow and costs rate and tax payers an astronomical amount for the sole benefit of watching aussie rules. So the NTCA facility will have far reaching benefits not only for Rangers, but for Launceston and South Launceston Cricket Clubs and the Old Scotch Football Club.
This facility will be well and truly capable of hosting possible Tasmanian State League Matches in 2013. You may now begin taring strips from me for having a point of view that doesn’t reflect that of the majority of the remaining 8 NPL Teams.
How about we fix our own league to start with. There is no money in soccer and it will unfort never be able to compete with AFL. AFL Tas subsidise each club for travel and are in a strong position to do so as they have the cash. Plus Soccer Tas isn't financial one bit..
ReplyDeleteWe as players have to pay $6 to play each week on top of our rego for the year. What a joke.. Clubs should not be making any money on players from both teams on a weekend. Send a team sheet to the club on a Fri and get players ticked off as they come through like the NTFL do. We as players put the show on. Supporters should still pay of course.
Maybe i am wrong, but does every $ from the 6 go to pay the referees?? If so why? It should be performance based what they get paid. Soccer Tas should be paying the referees not the players anyway.
Thats what happens with the AFL.
I cant think of one NTFL or State Football player that has to pay to get into the ground they play at. What a joke.
CF
Thanks for explaining that the ground is currently not up to scratch!
ReplyDeleteCF, would be good if clubs would agree to let all players on team sheet pass through, but every club would need to sign up and agree to it.
ReplyDeleteAll southern clubs let players and coaches managers etc. in for free. Beachside and Kingborough let everybody in for free, all div one and girls games are free. Players should not be paying.
ReplyDeleteI would love to get a look at Beachsides/Kingborough operating costs for the year, do they pay for insurance of their facilities, including volunteer insurance and public liability for $10 mill?
ReplyDeleteDo they pay for the actual lights and towers including blown globes at $300 a hit?
Do they pay the power bill for the whole 12 months?
Do they pay a ground rental including assisting with council costs for drainage, carparking and area beautification etc?
Do they pay for goal posts, coaches boxes and maintain ground fencing?
Do they have team bus costs after player payments of $2,000/year?
All of the above averages around $16,000/year that's why we charge everyone that we can, no magic sponsors up here.
Apart from having a cricket pitch in the middle NTCA is a good ground to play on.
ReplyDeleteAt least when it does rain they have staff there fulltime to work on the ground with super soakers etc. Ground is not ideal, however is not dangerous, and the game I played there back in April was in excellent condition, middle included.
I personally dont see the need for us to move to a state league, what is wrong with the Northern League the way it is. If all you club presidents out there stand firm and say we are not interested in going down this track, then surely nothing can happen.
NPL player
State league is the only way forward with quality players playing each other week in, week out which will develop the game much more then the current arrangement.
ReplyDeleteNigel,
ReplyDeleteAgreed that spectators should pay... but surely FFT has to pay for the referees not the players. They are our governing body in charge of referees. No wonder we lose players to AFL. With the rising cost of fuel, to get slugged an extra $6 just to get in to play the game is ridiculous. Even at our home games.
CF
I play with Somerset and when we played at the NTCA earlier in the year it was like playing on carpet, little hard in middle but rest was excellent.
ReplyDeleteTop three from the north plus top three from the south qualify each year for a state league run along side both the npl and spl. Scrap Lakosaljac cup plus the finals series, maybe start a week or so earlier and that will free up approx ten rounds which will be enough for each of those six teams to play each other both home and away. Teams that don't qualify could play in say a div 2 state league on the corresponding weekends. It will have to be seen as the premier competition therefore prizemoney for the sixth place getter would have to be equal to the npl and spl champions.
ReplyDeleteBasically the same as we have now, incentive to finish top three plus more quality games every third week or so.
Still think travel arrangements will be a big hurdle and it should be up to fft to somehow reimburse clubs for any expenses. Maybe the gate money pays for the travelling team and home team takes canteen and bar ect with fft paying for the referees instead of the clubs.
Sorry but knights played at the NTCA and the wicket was still marked and like concrete, not good and I beleive now it is a mud pit!
ReplyDeleteNot rangers fault but not good enough
I think anon 00:40 is on the right track. This sort of champions league format keeps our local comp as it is, therefore protecting all north and north-west clubs. We'd also get to play different teams regularly, which I'm sure we'd all enjoy for a change, and it should improve the standard.
ReplyDeleteA state league sounds fresh and exciting for those to whom it is a new concept, but we have tried this what, 3 times and it's failed so we know there are serious issues that need to be addressed. It is very expensive, and given the likely format would be seniors plus or minus colts only, clubs would need to either find 2 more teams to play in what is left of the NPL (seniors and reserves), or not enter the NPL at all. Given that any colts league would likely allow 3 overage players only, the rest of your overage players may need to play div1. God help them!
State league in that format would of course dilute the quality of the league for clubs left behind in the NPL. This isn't such a problem for southern clubs as they have much better depth, and already have a second division. They tend to forget this down south. We really need to protect these clubs as clubs like Ulvie and Somerset who may struggle to get into the state league at the moment (depending on the criteria) produce many of our best young players, and a lot of people have put alot of years into building all of our clubs.
The other option is to look at the bigger picture as Nigel and Cocksy have said and make them regional teams, but would clubs be happy to put the good of the game before themselves and give up their players?
When George Town were in state league (I know - amazing) the format was only a senior team, which meant games on Saturday and Sunday. From memory club officials (and players) might have gone to go to NW coast Saturday (NPL) and Hobart Sunday (state league)for instance.Or worse, you'd sometimes play on the same day at different venues.Given that most clubs seem to be kept alive by about 5 people this is quite a commitment.
As regards to which clubs will go into the proposed state league, Devonport for me are the only definite, the rest of us need to improve either current facilities or improve playing performance.
Incidently, what do the players think? Do they want to play state league, train 3 night a week and dedicate themselves to possible midweek games? If they don't we can probably stop the discussion here. No point playing in a state league if the players aren't going to approach it seriously.
My personal opinion is we do need to make changes to improve the game and give young players something to aspire to. There are a lot of very talented young players in the NPL,and throughout the state but overall the standard isn't nearly what it should be. Improving things does involve some type of statewide comp, but the format needs to be right.
As it stands, without a sponsor a state league won't go ahead anyway, FFT's words. And without a state league, no A-League team, therefore no youth pathway and no improvement in the standard.
Oh,and I think Kingborough get free rent from HCC, therefore no need to charge at the gate. The rest of us live in the real world!
Adam Whitemore
Maybe a conference style league mote similar to super 14 rugby would be a better option. Keep the leagues how they are but also cross over and travel say once a month which would also result in a state league table. Obvious issue is the length of the season it would make
ReplyDeleteI do find it interesting that riverside is never mentioned as a state league team. They along with rangers and laun city have the largest self sustaining junior clubs feeding into the senior sides, not including the coast of course
All the negative talk is about the cost !
ReplyDeleteIf it was say 5 teams from South that would mean 5 trips to Hobart at current some teams may have to Travel 2-3 times through the Statewide cup anyway.
Key is to find out how it can work not work on why it wont work !
AB
anon 11.29
ReplyDeleteDont all NPL (Launceston base) clubs have self sustaining junior clubs ?
And given your thoughts that juniors are the key then Launceston is No 1 as its under 18's are on top !
Maybe we should ponder the following:
ReplyDeleteFor a NPL Club to enter:
Seniors
Reserves
Under 18's
Womens
The cost is roughly as follows (paid to FFT)
Team Entries - 6K
Subs - 7K
Refs - 4K
So thats 17k to FFT x 9 clubs $153K
Playing for $7,825 prize money
to insure all NPL players would be $6,120 (roughly)
So for FFT to manage the NPL it must cost $140K hmmmmmmmm
p.s. Burnie cost are higher due to fines lol (sorry had to add that)
Anon 18.54
ReplyDeleteTell you something for nothing. Under 18s league these days, is a place for kids who generally will have no extended future in the game. Any decent kid these days will be playing reserves or seniors by the time they are 16.
Generally the standard of the under 18s is crap, with most of the kids being of average ability. Sure you have a few good 14 and 15 year olds there treading water waiting for the next step up, however if you are 17 and playing under 18s, your future is limited and the chances are you wont make it to the next level.
Launceston Uniteds 18s are the best of an average lot.
I think Adam Whitemores comments are the best summary of it all
ReplyDeleteAB I think the most important thing, is what happens to the NPL when you take say 3 teams out of it, it whithers and dies.
ReplyDeleteThe talk about cost is legitimate Anton because in the past this has been one of the biggest issues, so much so that FFT have admitted without a major sponsor it won't happen, due primarily to travel costs. You can't not address this issue as it is a major reason why it has failed in the past - 3 times?
ReplyDeleteAn 8 team league with 5 from the south, 2 north and 1 from the NW would mean at least 7 trips for the coastal team in a 2 round (14 game) comp. As you'd expect there'd be 3 rounds(21 games) this means possibly 10-11 away games (bus trips)for a coastal team and one less for northern sides. What did Somerset quote for a bus to Hobart? $1200-$1400? Hobart teams on the other hand only need to travel 3-5 times so it's no issue for them.
I agree though that we need to look for ways to make it work as well, but we can't ignore historical stumbling blocks.
Adam Whitemore
I'm a young player and the long and the short of it is, I want to play in a state league because its the kind of games you want to play week in week out. The kind of games that are the reason you play in the first place where the match is hotly contested and you need to keep performing each week. Not to just win the game but to keep your spot. If a state league brings the depth to clubs and strong competition I want to play.
ReplyDeleteI don't know a lot about the logistics involved with running a state league,the costs that follow and the hurdles that clubs and FFT face etc. But aren't we looking at the overall improvement of our game???
I've only played in the NPL for a season and a half and at the moment some games are challenging but I'm not improving at the rate that I'd want to be and its not because I'm not at training or the coaching isn't adequate because its great and most of the time its intense. However its the games you play on the weekend that you learn and improve from and again if a state league creates rapid improvement thats where I want to be
Adam ,you miss a point .So many people realise it . Now offer it up. in my opinion.
ReplyDeleteI played in the state league until the last year of its history... It attracted better players to our club and therefor benefited us in getting players, and we were not the best team but we were always up the top, once the state league finished we gradually lost most of our best players and the quality and atmosphere even if we had to travel to hobart most weeks was gone and to be honest the competion in both south and north has dropped a lot!! hopefully if there is any young player out there with enough talent to want be at the top and the think about the players they should bring it back even if they kept all the teams in the north and south and put them in one league Launceston Juventus has lost out due to state league demise and we always wanted it to stay
ReplyDeleteif the state league did go ahead, i think it would be great to see something like the bball with a marque player system were each team gets funds to sign a player who will bring great quality to the league and might put some bums on seats i know this wont happen due to lack of support finacially but would be good to see
ReplyDeleteTM